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Treedweller

Post by Treedweller » Thu Nov 01, 2007 3:51 am

No, Shane just gets obsessed with whatever beliefs he harbors at a specific point in his life and subsequently attempts to turn every discussion into something that revolves around the aforementioned beliefs and assumptions of other's beliefs to assert his own autonomous distance from his past. Because when Shane moves on, he severs all ties to who he was in the past and instead creates a 'new' present self that somehow still possesses the same essence.

Case in point: Capital Punishment, Philosophy, and now Atheism.

TheInspiration
Location: Nowhere of any interest.

Post by TheInspiration » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:02 am

DTaeKim wrote:
TheInspiration wrote:Might as well get the message through, because someone's got to. If anyone Christian here were to argue like that I'm sure they would get torn to pieces.
You mean bog-bog?
No, I mean any Christians here, so myself included.

TheInspiration
Location: Nowhere of any interest.

Post by TheInspiration » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:04 am

Gameshark wrote:I've insulted Bog before I was an atheist.... So please don't jump to conclusions =/
Oh well. I've not got a clue what Bog might do but why insult in the first place? Especially if you're trying to make an argument...

Most of your insults aren't that clever and your assumption that any person is stupid for being religious, and that atheism is clearly correct (hardly answers many questions does it?) is wrong as far as I'm concerned and downright arrogant.
Last edited by TheInspiration on Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

Gameshark

Post by Gameshark » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:04 am

Treedweller wrote: Case in point: Capital Punishment, Philosophy, and now Atheism.
Was a joke. Still interested in. Greatest thing in Mankind.



JUDGEMENTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAL

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Treedweller

Post by Treedweller » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:07 am

I only brought up Capital Punishment because I didn't want to be a horrible friend and mention a specific other incident.

As for me being judgmental, yes, yes I am dear.

Gameshark

Post by Gameshark » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:11 am

TheInspiration wrote:
Gameshark wrote:I've insulted Bog before I was an atheist.... So please don't jump to conclusions =/
Oh well. I've not got a clue what Bog might do but why insult in the first place? Especially if you're trying to make an argument...

Most of your insults aren't that clever and your assumption that any person is stupid for being religious, and that atheism is clearly correct (hardly answers many questions does it?) is wrong as far as I'm concerned and downright arrogant.
Specifics are fun!

I'm not arguing, just winding up someone who is funny to see go on rants about how the world sucks, etc etc.
Why is God considered an explanation for anything? It's not - it's a failure to explain, a shrug of the shoulders, an 'I dunno' dressed up in spirituality and ritual. If someone credits something to God, generally what it means is that they haven't a clue, so they're attributing it to an unreachable, unknowable sky-fairy. Ask for an explanation of where that bloke came from, and odds are you'll get a vague pseudo-philosophical reply about having always existed, or being outside nature. Which, of course, explains nothing.
Last edited by Gameshark on Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Terragent
Rank: Cussing Aussie
Location: Adelaide, Australia

Post by Terragent » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:12 am

Responding seriously to Shane is stupid, because all he'll do is laugh at you and say more rude things. And the irony is that I find his tasteless quasi-trolling far preferable to the uptight self-righteousness (not to mention the constant whinging victimhood) on display in this thread and every other recent discussion that's turned to religion. If you can't deal with rude people on the internet then GTFO, because they're certainly not about to.

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DTaeKim
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Post by DTaeKim » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:22 am

Heh. Leave it to Terragent to set things straight.
Last edited by DTaeKim on Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
What can change the nature of a man?

Gameshark

Post by Gameshark » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:29 am

Lets put it this way:

Bog -> Pissing into a Super soaker and shooting little kids with it.



GS -> Calling Bog stupid.... Hmmmm.

TheInspiration
Location: Nowhere of any interest.

Post by TheInspiration » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:35 am

Terragent wrote:Responding seriously to Shane is stupid, because all he'll do is laugh at you and say more rude things. And the irony is that I find his tasteless quasi-trolling far preferable to the uptight self-righteousness (not to mention the constant whinging victimhood) on display in this thread and every other recent discussion that's turned to religion. If you can't deal with rude people on the internet then GTFO, because they're certainly not about to.
Apologies for not knowing anything about Gameshark/Shane. Wouldn't want to change your opinion on him but it's odd you seem to find someone abusive far more tolerable than someone like me whose crimes (which you have of course responded to) have included bumping a thread made inactive after about a week and responding to someone making a tongue-in-cheek comment, in a tongue-in cheek response.

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Terragent
Rank: Cussing Aussie
Location: Adelaide, Australia

Post by Terragent » Thu Nov 01, 2007 5:20 am

You haven't committed any 'crimes'. You're just hypersensitive, uptight, and entirely too predictable for your own good. And you always assume that any ambiguous nasty remarks that might have been directed at you were specific and malicious attempts to make your life miserable.

You place far too much importance on these things. I'm not out to get you, I'm not your nemesis. I don't have a burning desire to validate your worldview of atheists being narrow-minded bigots who hate everything even vaguely religious. While I think they're silly and patently irrational, I don't actually care that much about your beliefs - or you, for that matter. What I say really shouldn't wind you up as much as it seems to. Chill out.
Last edited by Terragent on Thu Nov 01, 2007 5:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Shift Breaker
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Post by Shift Breaker » Thu Nov 01, 2007 5:25 am

AND AVAILABLE IN FIFTY DIFFERENT COLOURS.
"The part where you all shut up happens now." ~ thefalman
"I actually like to think of myself as a younger, hipper, more alive Nostradamus." ~ Treed
"Shifty, if I wasn't as manly a man as I am, I'd totally ask you out. And hope you'd wear that topless dude to impress me. In another lifetime, perhaps." ~ Nemmy
"Majora's Mask may by the only game I've played where someone was mooning me the entire time and I didn't care." ~ ThrawnFett

Bog
Meteor Striked
Meteor Striked

Post by Bog » Thu Nov 01, 2007 5:27 am

GS: Not the kids, the big ones.
Gameshark wrote:
TheInspiration wrote:Oh well. I've not got a clue what Bog might do but why insult in the first place? Especially if you're trying to make an argument...

Most of your insults aren't that clever and your assumption that any person is stupid for being religious, and that atheism is clearly correct (hardly answers many questions does it?) is wrong as far as I'm concerned and downright arrogant.
Specifics are fun!

I'm not arguing, just winding up someone who is funny to see go on rants about how the world sucks, etc etc.
You know, that could be defined as bullying.
Why is God considered an explanation for anything? It's not - it's a failure to explain, a shrug of the shoulders, an 'I dunno' dressed up in spirituality and ritual. If someone credits something to God, generally what it means is that they haven't a clue, so they're attributing it to an unreachable, unknowable sky-fairy. Ask for an explanation of where that bloke came from, and odds are you'll get a vague pseudo-philosophical reply about having always existed, or being outside nature. Which, of course, explains nothing.
That's correct in a warped way.

Have you ever read any of Plato's work? In his book, The Republic, he explains that this world is nothing but a shadow of the truth. And in a sense, he's correct, as we only know some things to be centainly true.
Plato wrote:Picture an underground cave. Inside this cave are rows upon rows of men all tied up in chains so that none can escape. They have their eyes fixed on the wall in front of them, and they have been there all of their lives. Behind them, a fire burns, and this fire creates shadows on the wall that the prisoners' see.
The fire represents true knowledge, and the prisoners represent us. They know nothing of life except what is inside the cave, as they've been there forever.
Plato wrote:Now imagine that one of the prisoners escape and walk out into the sunlight. Having never seen daylight before in his life, his skin, so unused to daylight, shrivels and burns.
In other words, the man walked into the truth - the truth of what life is really like. In doing so, he died.

That is why God does not tell us everything - knowing the truth would make us do something stupid. We are God's "prisoner" - we were created for Him to love and for His will.

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thefalman
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Post by thefalman » Thu Nov 01, 2007 5:35 am

ATTN: Topic.

It's my birthday. SHUT UP AND PARTY.

:D :D :D
Image
It took me a solid three minutes to fully comprehend your hair, Fallers. - Deoxy
Yes fal, you've got a good sense of style, you're clean shaven, and the cat on your head dares not move itself.
You look awesome. - Shift Breaker

I swear, you two are the worst couple ever. You've somehow managed to PDA on the internet through text. - Xenesis

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DTaeKim
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Post by DTaeKim » Thu Nov 01, 2007 5:37 am

Funny how you use a person who lived before the time of Christ to justify God.

I agree with thefalman. Let's party.
What can change the nature of a man?

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Terragent
Rank: Cussing Aussie
Location: Adelaide, Australia

Post by Terragent » Thu Nov 01, 2007 5:38 am

bog-bog wrote:In other words, the man walked into the truth - the truth of what life is really like. In doing so, he died.

That is why God does not tell us everything - knowing the truth would make us do something stupid. We are God's "prisoner" - we were created for Him to love and for His will.
That's a pretty terrible allegory. Walking into direct sunlight won't kill you unless you're a vampire or a WoW player.

It also makes no sense to assert that ignorance is bliss. The truth is the most beautiful thing in the universe. Knowledge empowers us - physically, politically, and spiritually. Deliberately avoiding facts for any reason - because they may conflict with ideas you hold dear, because they may incriminate you, or because they're difficult to acquire - is at best childish and at worst downright dangerous.

Assume, for this argument, that your Christian God exists. We have been created in His image - would he not desire us to grow and learn, and eventually become like Him? He is a father, after all, and it's a poor father who cannot cope with his children growing up.

EDIT: This needs less effort than partying. But very well, sir, party I shall. This calls for Rave On.

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Shift Breaker
Rank: Combo Chicken
Location: Definitely WWN. Really.

Post by Shift Breaker » Thu Nov 01, 2007 5:39 am

*Brings SexyBack*
"The part where you all shut up happens now." ~ thefalman
"I actually like to think of myself as a younger, hipper, more alive Nostradamus." ~ Treed
"Shifty, if I wasn't as manly a man as I am, I'd totally ask you out. And hope you'd wear that topless dude to impress me. In another lifetime, perhaps." ~ Nemmy
"Majora's Mask may by the only game I've played where someone was mooning me the entire time and I didn't care." ~ ThrawnFett

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DTaeKim
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Post by DTaeKim » Thu Nov 01, 2007 6:14 am

*Sings bad karaoke.
What can change the nature of a man?

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Terragent
Rank: Cussing Aussie
Location: Adelaide, Australia

Post by Terragent » Thu Nov 01, 2007 6:21 am

Master, this is wonderful! Simply wonderful! A party is such fun!

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Joey Chicago
Meteor Striked
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Post by Joey Chicago » Thu Nov 01, 2007 6:56 am

bog-bog wrote:Don't worry, Inspiration. I pity Athiests - too stubborn to listen to anyone but themselves.
I don't pity Christians as a whole. But I do pity Christians who pity atheists.

I was pretty closed-minded about my atheism a while ago, but now I'm trying to keep an open mind. I appreciate it when theists keep an open mind about my beliefs (many don't), so I might as well return the favor by being an atheist that keeps an open mind about their beliefs.

If you classify us all as a whole like that, you are truly being just as bad as we are.


And on a separate note, Bog, you seem to have some of the same misconceptions about religion that you had when you got here. You certainly have become a better and more open-minded individual, but since you returned recently, you seem to have gone back a bit. Now, I know that I'm not perfect, but I'm sincerely worried that your mind is moving in reverse, becoming more and more closed-minded, the exact thing that you just preached against in the quoted post.

An example is when you claimed that evolution was essentially atheists trying to come up with an explanation for how things are. Not only is this ignorant, but you have also clearly not listened to what the other side has to say.

I might have expected this from you about a year ago, but I was surprised that you began to act this way when you returned. You had definitely matured in the way that you think and post, but then this happened.

Take this not as an insult to who you are, but as a warning. I'm afraid that you may go back to what you once were.




Also, atheists. Drill it into your head. Atheism.
"Live every week like it's Shark Week." - Tracy Jordan

"And there's a tax on people who smoke tobacco with a bong in public solely to be provocative." - Chris Onstad

i am a heron. i ahev a long neck and i pick fish out of the water w/ my beak. if you dont repost this comment on 10 other pages i will fly into your kitchen tonight and make a mess of your pots and pans

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Treedweller

Post by Treedweller » Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:48 am

We were almost over this hill, then Una comes.

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Shift Breaker
Rank: Combo Chicken
Location: Definitely WWN. Really.

Post by Shift Breaker » Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:49 am

Note to self: At vertain pointsof each year. KILL Una and bog.

Resurrect one or both of them afterwards.
"The part where you all shut up happens now." ~ thefalman
"I actually like to think of myself as a younger, hipper, more alive Nostradamus." ~ Treed
"Shifty, if I wasn't as manly a man as I am, I'd totally ask you out. And hope you'd wear that topless dude to impress me. In another lifetime, perhaps." ~ Nemmy
"Majora's Mask may by the only game I've played where someone was mooning me the entire time and I didn't care." ~ ThrawnFett

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Joey Chicago
Meteor Striked
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Post by Joey Chicago » Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:53 am

Treedweller wrote:We were almost over this hill, then Una comes.
If we let this be, another one of these topics that suddenly swerve towards religion will happen. This is starting to piss me off.
"Live every week like it's Shark Week." - Tracy Jordan

"And there's a tax on people who smoke tobacco with a bong in public solely to be provocative." - Chris Onstad

i am a heron. i ahev a long neck and i pick fish out of the water w/ my beak. if you dont repost this comment on 10 other pages i will fly into your kitchen tonight and make a mess of your pots and pans

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Treedweller

Post by Treedweller » Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:59 am

Don't give attention to what bothers you.

TheInspiration
Location: Nowhere of any interest.

Post by TheInspiration » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:02 am

Terragent wrote:You haven't committed any 'crimes'. You're just hypersensitive, uptight, and entirely too predictable for your own good. And you always assume that any ambiguous nasty remarks that might have been directed at you were specific and malicious attempts to make your life miserable.

You place far too much importance on these things. I'm not out to get you, I'm not your nemesis. I don't have a burning desire to validate your worldview of atheists being narrow-minded bigots who hate everything even vaguely religious. While I think they're silly and patently irrational, I don't actually care that much about your beliefs - or you, for that matter. What I say really shouldn't wind you up as much as it seems to. Chill out.
I generally don't get so worked up. I just think you seem to attack me quite easily and unfairly but in all honesty if that's in the past there's no point dwelling on it.

I'm not sure whether to take the point about my worldview of atheists seriously. Of course I don't think that is the case! I never said that about all of them collectively at all.

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Shift Breaker
Rank: Combo Chicken
Location: Definitely WWN. Really.

Post by Shift Breaker » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:02 am

I say Treed, why don't we have an intelligent discussion on the cutting of pumpkins, good chap!
"The part where you all shut up happens now." ~ thefalman
"I actually like to think of myself as a younger, hipper, more alive Nostradamus." ~ Treed
"Shifty, if I wasn't as manly a man as I am, I'd totally ask you out. And hope you'd wear that topless dude to impress me. In another lifetime, perhaps." ~ Nemmy
"Majora's Mask may by the only game I've played where someone was mooning me the entire time and I didn't care." ~ ThrawnFett

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Treedweller

Post by Treedweller » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:05 am

Shift Breaker wrote:I say Treed, why don't we have an intelligent discussion on the cutting of pumpkins, good chap!
Well, unfortunately, despite seeing pumpkins for very cheap on display in the grocery stores, I didn't follow on an impulse and buy one ;_;

Oooh, but I have a super cool idea for next year's Halloween on WWN! We could like, buy pumpkins, carve them, and then post pictures of our most creative creations and turn it into some kind of super awesome contest with a panel of judges that deliberate our artistic skills; oh man, I'd totally do that <3

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Shift Breaker
Rank: Combo Chicken
Location: Definitely WWN. Really.

Post by Shift Breaker » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:06 am

Oh, If I've ever bought pumpkins and could carbe well, I'd so totally do that, good sir.
"The part where you all shut up happens now." ~ thefalman
"I actually like to think of myself as a younger, hipper, more alive Nostradamus." ~ Treed
"Shifty, if I wasn't as manly a man as I am, I'd totally ask you out. And hope you'd wear that topless dude to impress me. In another lifetime, perhaps." ~ Nemmy
"Majora's Mask may by the only game I've played where someone was mooning me the entire time and I didn't care." ~ ThrawnFett

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McTool
Rank: East Coast Deity Lord

Post by McTool » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:07 am

I cut my finger open cutting pumpkins last year.

I felt pretty stupid after that.
Make good choices

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Treedweller

Post by Treedweller » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:09 am

Who said you had to carve well? Since when is modern art based on talent rather than weird abstraction?

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Terragent
Rank: Cussing Aussie
Location: Adelaide, Australia

Post by Terragent » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:11 am

Treedweller wrote:Don't give attention to what bothers you.
It's the truth.

That said, I'm not sorry - I was having fun.

TheInspiration
Location: Nowhere of any interest.

Post by TheInspiration » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:13 am

Unakau wrote:
bog-bog wrote:Don't worry, Inspiration. I pity Athiests - too stubborn to listen to anyone but themselves.
I don't pity Christians as a whole. But I do pity Christians who pity atheists.

I was pretty closed-minded about my atheism a while ago, but now I'm trying to keep an open mind. I appreciate it when theists keep an open mind about my beliefs (many don't), so I might as well return the favor by being an atheist that keeps an open mind about their beliefs.

If you classify us all as a whole like that, you are truly being just as bad as we are.


And on a separate note, Bog, you seem to have some of the same misconceptions about religion that you had when you got here. You certainly have become a better and more open-minded individual, but since you returned recently, you seem to have gone back a bit. Now, I know that I'm not perfect, but I'm sincerely worried that your mind is moving in reverse, becoming more and more closed-minded, the exact thing that you just preached against in the quoted post.

An example is when you claimed that evolution was essentially atheists trying to come up with an explanation for how things are. Not only is this ignorant, but you have also clearly not listened to what the other side has to say.

I might have expected this from you about a year ago, but I was surprised that you began to act this way when you returned. You had definitely matured in the way that you think and post, but then this happened.

Take this not as an insult to who you are, but as a warning. I'm afraid that you may go back to what you once were.




Also, atheists. Drill it into your head. Atheism.
That's the way to go about things in my opinion. I'm obviously not perfect but I aim to keep an open mind at least. I can't stand narrow-minded people - theists or atheists. I can pull apart Christian ideas and Terragent makes a very valid point above, however it's not one that proves Christianity false. Philosophical arguments like the problem of evil make me question God, but not really doubt his existence. On the other hand, Christianity appears ridiculous to plenty of people and I don't like this idea because there's more than enough in stall if someone studies theology (for example) to at least think Christianity is rational, even if not true.

Bare in mind it looks like I'll be off to university next year to study theology and I study philosophy at school right now so I've got to keep an open mind.

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Treedweller

Post by Treedweller » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:17 am

Also we'd have to force DC to come back to be one of the judges.

Powdered Toast Man

Post by Powdered Toast Man » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:18 am

The falmeister deserves his own topic. Party in ASDF!

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Hooded_Miracle
Rank: Hoodie with a Target

Post by Hooded_Miracle » Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:03 am

Forget religion.

Wanna know why?

It's distracting you from the party!

*Throws holy water at Unakau and Bog*

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Shift Breaker
Rank: Combo Chicken
Location: Definitely WWN. Really.

Post by Shift Breaker » Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:24 am

Good thing they're not alight, then. Your kitten is safe.
"The part where you all shut up happens now." ~ thefalman
"I actually like to think of myself as a younger, hipper, more alive Nostradamus." ~ Treed
"Shifty, if I wasn't as manly a man as I am, I'd totally ask you out. And hope you'd wear that topless dude to impress me. In another lifetime, perhaps." ~ Nemmy
"Majora's Mask may by the only game I've played where someone was mooning me the entire time and I didn't care." ~ ThrawnFett

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RadioShadow
Rank: Holding the Mega Drive controller
Location: UK, England

Post by RadioShadow » Thu Nov 01, 2007 10:26 am

So what does Religion have to do with Halloween again?

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Joey Chicago
Meteor Striked
Meteor Striked
Location: Woodbury, Minnesota

Post by Joey Chicago » Thu Nov 01, 2007 10:49 am

A lot, actually.
"Live every week like it's Shark Week." - Tracy Jordan

"And there's a tax on people who smoke tobacco with a bong in public solely to be provocative." - Chris Onstad

i am a heron. i ahev a long neck and i pick fish out of the water w/ my beak. if you dont repost this comment on 10 other pages i will fly into your kitchen tonight and make a mess of your pots and pans

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Treedweller

Post by Treedweller » Thu Nov 01, 2007 10:51 am

pretension and facts everyone knows don't go over it please

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Alecat
Rank: Stalker

Post by Alecat » Thu Nov 01, 2007 11:02 am

Mmm, pumpkinten.

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