Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Discussion of complete and in-progress major AW Hacks or Projects - challenge hacks, War Room map packs, Online Advance Wars sims.

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GipFace
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by GipFace » Fri Oct 10, 2014 1:02 am

Here's the reality. If you want the coding aspect of the project done, you mostly gotta do it yourself.

Re Heroic Spyro about "quality" over timely releases:

Zarel coded Pokemon Showdown (PS) by HIMSELF in one month. (http://www.reddit.com/r/stunfisk/commen ... _showdown/) It now gets over 10000 concurrent users daily. Its predecessor, Pokemon-Online, only had a peak of about 1000. Basically, Zarel set the bar that CWT needs to meet. Pokemon, with its thousands of moves, abilities, formats, and variables, is a more complicated game than the 25 unit + 40ish CO count of Advance Wars. If Zarel can code PS in a month, this team should be able to put out something after nearly two years.

PS doesn't have an AI, but it didn't need to. I always thought that putting AI into CWT was a waste of time. If people want to play AW singleplayer, they have the actual games. What's needed right now is a multiplayer replacement because AWBW sucks and AW4 WFC is dead.

So yeah, people can make up all the excuses and cries for help. But Zarel didn't go on forums to ask for baby food. He had testicles and perfectly crafted a PvP platform of a children's handheld game with zero outside support. That means CWT could do it too. I'm mostly negative about these fan projects because to this day, AWBW is the only one that ever came to fruition. The rest fail time and time again. You want to impress someone? Actually do something. Robosturm's project was nothing.

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Blame Game

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Blame Game » Mon Oct 13, 2014 1:15 am

(I'd feel remiss if i didnt mention as a quick preface that gipface has no credibility on this topic whatsoever, nor any place in this community so far as i can see, and that it is quite discouraging that he has not yet been permanently banned)

Because he hasn't done anything worth being permanently banned. Being glib or acerbic isn't a crime. - Xen

Nobody can really know what the best release strategy for this game is. The pokemon community is huge and hypermotivated with a long history of popular simulators. The advance wars community is small and listless.

I think keeping things really simple to start with might be best though. I wouldnt even necessarily focus on being an accurate simulator, personally (at least to start). Certainly i would not try to overwhelm people with long guides and like 80 COs or whatever.

As for how 'complete' it should be prior to a release though, its tough to say. I would straight up not bother with art unless someone like narts decided to straight up do it for free, which is not something anyone should be expectant of. I do think the most important thing is feel/playability, whether the focus is online or single player

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Bonesy
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Bonesy » Sun Oct 19, 2014 1:33 am

i think gip has more credibility here than you :^)

GipFace
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by GipFace » Sun Oct 19, 2014 5:11 am

PS gets 10X more traffic than its predecessor and that's not because of the simulator history. It's because PS is almost perfect in both game accuracy and its interface. You can literally go to the website and be in a random battle in under 30 seconds.

By the way, just to show how on-the-ball they are, they added Omega Ruby/Alpha Sapphire mega evolutions within 24 hours of someone hacking the demo and releasing the base stats.

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Robosturm
Rank: Metall Legion Leader

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Robosturm » Sun Oct 19, 2014 5:42 am

I didn't want to join this conversation but since Gip was already negative 2 years ago when i take a break on programming CoW.
I need to say something here.

Well i agree with Blame Game.

Gip is just negative.

You compare two thinks that cant be compared for the simple fact that Pokemon has more users doing the stuff.

And then hacking in some tables with a lot of people is quite easy, but programming all stuff that uses those tables needs time.

And if only one person does the coding and only has two or three hours time a week. It needs more time.

And saying you're bad is easy but prooving that you can do it better well.

Let's say we give you one month time to programm an AW-Game. If you manage that you can blame others if you don't...
Commander Wars only another AW-Clone?
Want to help us? (We search some spriters)
CommanderWars@gmx.de

GipFace
Rank: Lord of Children Games

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by GipFace » Sun Oct 19, 2014 9:25 am

Robosturm wrote:You compare two thinks that cant be compared for the simple fact that Pokemon has more users doing the stuff.
There are multiple coders now, but Zarel coded the first PS build by himself in one month. This remains a fact. It doesn't matter how large the communities are.

I don't know how to program. However, what I did was experiment with Desmume, and with the help of Xenesis, and released a package that allowed AW4 PVP to be played on the PC. This addressed the main issue playing via Nintendo WFC: only WEP was supported, but WPA2 is the wi-fi encryption standard. The ROM that was contained in the package included the 2-minute timer hack, allowing PvP matches to be timed, and the random map rotation reduction hack, removing relics like Crater Isle.

I've also played multiple AW3 matches via TeamViewer with various people on IRC.

What this all means is that I've directly contributed more towards PvP AW than you. Whatever anyone makes has to be better than the Teamviewer method (for AW3) or the Desmume package (for AW4). As of now I haven't seen anything close to that. If you can't improve on the current playing methods, why should I give you any attention?

Your move.
Last edited by GipFace on Sun Oct 19, 2014 9:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Sven

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Sven » Sun Oct 19, 2014 9:34 am

awbw better than both. has been for 10 years.

gg

GipFace
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by GipFace » Sun Oct 19, 2014 9:36 am

If you like AWBW Rachel hitting her own units with her SCOP sure

Let's not forget infinite APC loading trick too

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Sven

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Sven » Sun Oct 19, 2014 9:46 am

it's not a bug, it's a feature. :lol:

AnonymousPerson

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by AnonymousPerson » Sun Oct 19, 2014 2:03 pm

ITT: programmers must each create entire games from scratch with absolutely NO way to blind test it, or suck forever.

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Robosturm
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Robosturm » Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:33 pm

First CoW never claimed to make an AW PvP-Game.
It's was always a project for me to learn programming.

And i don't argue about if you did something for PvP playing.

It's about you're negative attidute towards people who try to program a game and don't release or do stuff the way you want it to be done.

And by writing there work is bad you force them to stop working on CWT.

And if you try to make Game-Platform as JSRulez does that takes a lot more work than writing an AW-Game.

You need a lot more time for the first game to finish but after that the next adoptation is a lot easier.

Including something to CoW e.g. is a pain in the ass.
But i don't care about it. It works and you can play it now.

And i wish JSRulez Good Luck to finish a running CWT-Engine.
Commander Wars only another AW-Clone?
Want to help us? (We search some spriters)
CommanderWars@gmx.de

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JSRulz

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by JSRulz » Thu Nov 27, 2014 10:01 pm

Thanks for all the support and concern about the project. Good or not so good comments, I really appreciate it all. Robosturm I wish you well on CoW as well.

Honestly, comparing something like CWT to Pokemon is literally like comparing building a car out of LEGOS and building an entire city out of LEGOS. Pokemon is literally a menu with statistics attached.
  • In Pokemon, you battle by just making sure an HP stat goes to 0. They really only have to track one statistic and the ailments for 6 objects, and possibly battle animations.
  • AW has exactly what Pokemon has plus AI and player pathfinding, dynamic maps, many different unit types, many bases for building units, Commanding officers that change the stats for units in many different ways beyond the normal ruleset, terrain stats, etc.
If you add the fact we are allowing customization, this project is at least 100x bigger than Pokemon Online is currently.

I mean, the amount of research we are doing to make sure we get the speed and quality not seen in an AW clone to date, is probably unparalleled. We are literally trying to hit every platform, make it small and streamlined enough to fit in the strict requirements of the mobile devices, and create an experience that caters to the community as much as possible. It is literally a developers nightmare, as the community isn't always the easiest to please.

Make no mistake, we are working hard to make this happen. This is a game that we are literally building for ourselves, and we have high expectations for it. I want to be wowed by this, and in order for that to happen, it can't just be another average experience. So, I did what is important to make sure we get the quality desired. Yes, releases will be slow and sporadic. But, they will also be substantial in many categories.

But, we also have lives outside of just coding this. So, I can only say that we will "try hard" to hit release dates. The only place in where this isn't true is when I make an announcement on the CWT blog. If I say the game will be updated on there, there is a 99% chance that it will. For now, I just can't guarantee the features in the middle of the process of working on them. Sometimes we intend to add things and they don't work. Sometimes, I allow new ideas to seep into the project. I follow a plan, but I promise to seek improvement with every change.

For all those who continue to follow, I thank you all for your support. You guys are all so important to my efforts. In all honesty, I speak for all developers when I say that your support is the prime reason why these projects exist, and ultimately, decides whether they will be successful in the end.

JSRulz
CWT Team Lead

GipFace
Rank: Lord of Children Games

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by GipFace » Tue Dec 09, 2014 7:04 am

Here is what an AW unit has:

Unit type
Health (out of 100)
Ammo
Gas
Ownership (who controls it?)
X position on map
Y position on map
Unit number (for L-cycling)
2 attack modifiers (unit, CO)
2 defense modifiers (unit, CO)
CO range modifier (for indirect units)
COP effect (flashing, stunned?)

That's 14 variables.

Now here is what a Pokemon has, not counting pointless data such as where it was hatched:

Pokedex number
6 IVs (HP, ATK, DEF, SPA, SPD, SPE. Usually all 31 except Trick Roomers who have 0 IV for SPE, and special-only attackers who have 0 IV for ATK to lower confusion damage)
6 EVs (HP, ATK, DEF, SPA, SPD, SPE)
Nature
Ability
4 moves
4 PP
4 PP Up check
Current HP
Held item
7 stat modifiers (ATK, DEF, SPA, SPD, SPE, ACC, EVA)
Ailment modifier (OK, PRZ, BRN, FRE, PSN, TOX, SLP)
Temporary modifiers (e.g. tormented, confusion)
Critical hit rate

That's no less than 39 variables per Pokemon.
Last edited by GipFace on Tue Dec 09, 2014 4:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Linkman
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Linkman » Tue Dec 09, 2014 8:53 am

I can literally program a functional pokemon game in a few afternoons using text-only crumpets Gip. In fact people used to play using IRC scripts.

It's not nearly the same complexity as AW. Besides, the argument is moot when CWT (and previously CW, and CoW, and whatever else) already have a playable and functional build. The objectives they're aiming for are different.
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by GipFace » Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:16 am

Yes, I used to play on those IRC bots. But that's irrelevant. I gave real evidence that Pokemon is a more complicated game. There are simply more variables.

In competitive battling on PS, I have to whip out the damage calculator for every critical moment. Will my Lv82 Hariyama with Life Orb, neutral nature, and 85EV to ATK, KO a Lv70 Lugia, with neutral nature and 85EV to HP and DEF, at 15% HP with Bullet Punch before Lugia can recover? How on Earth am I supposed to do that calculation in my head?

In AW it's much easier to memorize key 1HKO matchups. I can tell you off my head that a 170A Tashacopter deals 99% to a 120D tank. As DEF increases the calculation is more difficult but you can get an approximation to the nearest 1-2% with the "rule of 8", which means you add or subtract 8 to the DEF multiplier for every 10 DEF difference. If you have played any sort of competitive AW then these calculations are second-nature. But people have played Pokemon for nearly 20 years and its damage formula is still voodoo.

The charm about AW is that the core mechanics are very simple. Games become complex from board positions. However, the complexity of the board position has nothing to do with programming game mechanics unless you are programming an AI. I've already said before that AW AI programming is a waste of time.
Last edited by GipFace on Wed Dec 10, 2014 8:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Xenesis
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Xenesis » Wed Dec 10, 2014 7:46 am

GipFace wrote:The charm about AW is that the core mechanics are very simple. Games become complex from board positions. However, the complexity of the board position has nothing to do with programming game mechanics unless you are programming an AI.
That's one of the things that makes Pokemon a simpler game to program than AW - Pokemon is literally a bundle of variables which you resolve turn by turn, you actually have to deal with all the spatial problems in AW.

Regardless of Pokemon's voodoo mathematics (which just makes player evaluation hard) there's no mapping or spatial component to deal with (which can be a non-trivial problem for programming).
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x0_000
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by x0_000 » Thu Dec 11, 2014 6:31 am

GipFace wrote:Here is what an AW unit has:

That's 14 variables.

Now here is what a Pokemon has, not counting pointless data such as where it was hatched:

That's no less than 39 variables per Pokemon.
but there are more units in an aw match than pokemon in a pokemon match???

also, things you forgot to track:
dived/stealthed
loaded units
move modifier (if you're going to count range modifier)
Only in math can you buy 600 cantaloupes and not look like a nutter.

GipFace
Rank: Lord of Children Games

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by GipFace » Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:15 pm

I'd like to think that sea units don't exist >.<

Kamuscha_86

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Kamuscha_86 » Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:26 pm

I thought we were building a game, not dive into a debate. It's not very effective.

So anyways, I was wondering about the feature that CCOs would be added intuitively by users into the game. Since there are at least 14 variables, why not make those variables open to adjustment by the user? To take it a step further, have new units be available, much like Age of Strategy for Android, despite its horribly cumbersome interface....

I agree, getting the prototype running is important, and that setting up the interface to be intuitive and unobtrusive will go a long way towards getting this project off the base and towards the HQ. No one told the infantry it was easy to cross mountains......

I am an AW fan and still enjoy the game to this day. Nothing compares to the intuitive gameplay AW offers, nothing. I hope that CW continues to flourish and become an incredible gameplay experience for Casual and Advanced players alike.

I hear you need some art and sprite work done? Could I help somewhere in the creative department?

GipFace
Rank: Lord of Children Games

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by GipFace » Tue Dec 16, 2014 1:50 am

There have been so many times where someone comes in and wants to make an online AW. Here are your choices:

1. You actually program an online AW game
2. YOU PLAY THE CANON GAME
3. You engage in personal relationships on an AW board and get murdered like Matthew Pyke
4. You find another hobby

Guess what, I'm up for a game anytime on AW3 Teamviewer or AW4 WFC (there are unofficial servers now that Nintendo WFC is dead). Some people only like AW for singleplayer and that's fine. But this community is full of people who for some reason or another don't want to play pvp canon AW, preferring the mess that is AWBW, which is why I question all online AW projects in general. Even if by some miracle this is completed, who will be around to play it?

Kamuscha_86

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Kamuscha_86 » Tue Dec 16, 2014 5:38 am

True. While Canon AW may have lost its appeal to players, the custom aspect of CWT has a lot going in its favor. A lot of the CCOs from the custom thread are asking to get into the game. The developers really don't have to implement all the CCOs as they deem fit, the players themselves can add that sort of data into the game themselves, much like customizing their own character in an RPG. Adding that custom element in CWT will set itself apart from all AW projects to date. In all honesty, players do have that kind of freedom to edit values and moves for their pokemon. Why not extend that freedom to AW players? We could even go further and make different modes available too, like "AWBW" mode with the APC glitch feature, and Canon mode, to name a few.

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Narts
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Narts » Tue Dec 16, 2014 8:52 am

Nah, no. Not really. The original Custom Wars made it abundantly clear that 95% of all custom CO ideas are nothing short of trainwrecks that just don't work in practise - and the rest are just slightly modified versions of the existing canon CO's and bring nothing interesting to the table. The official games were pretty good at covering all the interesting and playable possibilities that the game rules allowed.

I have been of the opinion for quite some time that if you want to make an interesting AW-a-like (that isn't just a simulator of the canon games), you have to radically shake the foundations and change the fundamental game rules themselves.

That, of course, would make it not Advance Wars anymore, which I guess would go against the motivations of most people trying to write an AW clone.

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JSRulz

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by JSRulz » Tue Dec 16, 2014 11:39 am

Oh nice, non-debate questions. Let me get on those straight away...

"So anyways, I was wondering about the feature that CCOs would be added intuitively by users into the game. Since there are at least 14 variables, why not make those variables open to adjustment by the user? To take it a step further, have new units be available, much like Age of Strategy for Android, despite its horribly cumbersome interface...." - Kamuscha_86

That is definitely in the works, though currently, my major goal is just to get the core original games out first and stable before I start worrying about custom content. The way we are planning to handle most custom content will be in files. For instance, this is an example for Andy.
Spoiler: show

Code: Select all

{
    "ID"        : "ANDY",
    "faction"   : "ORST",
    "music"     : "Andy.mp3",
    "coStars"   : 3,
    "scoStars"  : 6,
    "d2d"       : [
    ],
    "cop" : {
      "turn":[],
      "power":{
        "healUnits":[
          {
            "target":0,
            "amount":2
          }
        ]
      }
    },
    "scop" : {
      "turn":[
        {
          "att"        : 30,
          "movepoints" : 1
        }
      ],
      "power":{
        "healUnits":[
          {
            "target":0,
            "amount":5
          }
        ]
      }
    }
  }
The power to edit statistics will be in the hands of the player. Adding new content will follow the same structure for CO's, units, terrain, etc. At least on the player's local PC, this will be something that will be a natural part of the game. When it comes to the server however, I'm putting full priority towards making sure the core games work at peak efficiency first before trying to allow custom content on the server. Creating maps will be the first major test to see exactly how much data we can handle when the time comes.

"I hear you need some art and sprite work done? Could I help somewhere in the creative department?" - Kamuscha_86

Yes, this is true. I am always looking for artists and sprite work. I usually handle these things via PM to avoid cluttering any boards with development banter. However, if you want to get a sneak peak on the type of work we are looking for, then you can follow The Artist Pact. Any other questions can be sent directly to me using the "Contact Us" link on the Main Page.

"Even if by some miracle this is completed, who will be around to play it?" - Gipface

The challenges are right in front of us. I know that at least in the fighting game genre, a fighting community only remains a fighting community given that there is a lot of players still invested in playing the game. Launching a server without any backing community will just produce a ghost town. The only games that stood the test of time are those that focused on bringing a total experience to the user. That is, the games that focused not only on multi-player, but also single player experiences. Otherwise, the game gets stuck in the endless development cycle constantly having to push out new content to stay relevant. The fact is, we just don't know if there is a community left that will appreciate the game being created. Custom Wars Tactics (or any other formula breaking spin-off of Advance Wars), needs visibility in order to see whether people are still invested in the series. The community is fragmented, the history is disappearing, and it seems time is running out.

"I have been of the opinion for quite some time that if you want to make an interesting AW-a-like (that isn't just a simulator of the canon games), you have to radically shake the foundations and change the fundamental game rules themselves." - Narts

Exactly. We need to show everyone out there that Advance Wars matters to us. We need to show them that it is worth our time, our energy, and that it deserves a reboot. For me, personally, I think that Advance Wars has potential to make a decent spin-off. My concern comes from exactly how many people are interested in Advance Wars to find it online. Custom Wars Tactics is my way of finding the answer to see exactly how many people are invested in this series. As the project builds, I'll be keeping a close eye on the number of people's views and retention on the CWT page. I am well aware that a revamp is way overdue, but currently, there is just not enough retention or hype to justify it.

Honestly, it is all the more reason why people should support ventures like Custom Wars Tactics, Commander Wars, and Super Battlelands. We have to continuously take advantage of the opportunities we have to keep AW alive, or deem them lost forever...

Kamuscha_86

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Kamuscha_86 » Wed Dec 17, 2014 10:33 am

Point well taken. I am still interested though. Based on some of the research I've done, it appears that making the AI at least decent enough for gameplay is one of several major hurdles in bringing this game to completion. This is one thing that AWBW lacks, but makes up for it in features and customisation with maps and setting games. I wanted to ask about the priority of things to be completed before this game can be launched. Is it completely coded in Java? And has anyone attempted to create it in Gamesalad and Stencyl? What were the pros and cons about it? And how do we add content/test the game in the Open Beta files section?

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JSRulz

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by JSRulz » Wed Dec 17, 2014 3:51 pm

Hey Kamusha_86,

Sure I'll answer your questions and add to your comments....

"Based on some of the research I've done, it appears that making the AI at least decent enough for gameplay is one of several major hurdles in bringing this game to completion. This is one thing that AWBW lacks, but makes up for it in features and customisation with maps and setting games."

Tell me about it. Honestly, it is the roughest part of development for us. We have done loads and loads of research on the subject. I mean, look at this...
AI Development Research

There is another AI document on the way written by yours truly. The big change we are making is allowing us to continue to develop the AI via text files, much like people would do with the customization files (when they become available). However, this is pretty much all future tasks. Currently, I hope to at least match what AWBW and CW brings to the table, alongside a decent AI.

"Is it completely coded in Java?"

Somewhat. This program is coded primarily in Javascript/HTML5, with Java as a secondary language.

The big reason why people are able to play this on tablets and phones is because of JavaScript. The browser version available now was made specifically to cater to those devices. Later on, we will address the PC users concerns with a Java version of the game, which should allow players to use all the shortcuts they have come so used to for PC.

"And has anyone attempted to create it in Gamesalad and Stencyl?"

I believe there were attempts, but no concrete games made in it as of yet. I haven't really dug around looking for them, but I think there is a few leads...

Gamesalad - AW
Stencyl - AW

"What were the pros and cons about it?"

About creating the game in Stencyl/Gamesalad?

Well, I haven't attempted to do that. Since I'm a pure programmer already, then I really don't have to use the drag and drop no coding solutions.

The only pro to these solutions is that you don't have to code. It may help others be able to contribute, but I'd rather stay away because of the cons.
The cons is that these programs usually cost money to get your item published, they come with a speed/development limitations, and the program is stuck to whatever platforms they support.

Currently, we only code one time to get it to run on all these devices. If I were going through any other development tool, this wouldn't be the case as we'd probably have to use many of these to fit our needs. The limitations will disrupt the speed, and chances are it'll cost us money to publish. Since I know how to code however, I can just skip all the hassle of drag and drop development, keeping this game free which is just where I want it to be.

And how do we add content/test the game in the Open Beta files section?

At this specific moment, you can't as a user. We are planning to release that functionality when we release the desktop version.

But...

If you know development and a bit of Javascript, you can use our repository to get all the files.
CWT Repository

Then, you can use the link below to help deploy it on your PC...
CWT Deployment

As you can imagine, this is not easy to do as you'd have to use nodeJS to make a copy of the game in your PC, just to be able to edit the data. If you can't wait until the release, then building it from scratch would be your best option.

JSRulz
CWT Team Lead
Last edited by JSRulz on Wed Dec 17, 2014 8:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Kamuscha_86

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Kamuscha_86 » Wed Dec 17, 2014 7:18 pm

Wow, awesome post. It was especially helpful to hear another's perspective on game creation softwares. I just have my head scratching over the fact that Age of Strategy is playable on Android, which I have, but that an AW-alike game has not yet been released, despite the numerous attempts as shown in the forums. Perhaps this is our shot at showing them that AW still matters?

Again, thank you for leading me to the documentation and the github repo. Reading up on Eclipse made it a lot clearer for me. I am headed to Oregon from So Cal, so I won't be able to do software stuff until I get back.

In the event that CWT becomes a successful project, is there a possibility that it will be playable as an app, i.e. apk file format, for mobile devices, or is that currently in development with PC being the first one to be released first?

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!

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JSRulz

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by JSRulz » Wed Dec 17, 2014 8:25 pm

Hey Kamuscha_86,

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you as well! Thank you!

"In the event that CWT becomes a successful project, is there a possibility that it will be playable as an app, i.e. apk file format, for mobile devices, or is that currently in development with PC being the first one to be released first?"

We are literally focusing everything we have into the online browser (JavaScript) version of the game. The reason for this is because between the PC (Java) versus the browser, the PC has unlimited space while we have to squeeze CWT into the tiny 5MB shell of the mobile browser devices. By the way, JavaScript can deploy itself as an app in your device via nodeJS (which we are already using). So, yes, if we wanted we could deploy this as an app, with the only weakness being that it won't be part of any app store. Chances are 99.99% that both the PC Desktop (Java) and the Online Browser (JavaScript) versions will be online and playable as of Custom Wars Tactics Version 1.0.

I can't really measure what successful CWT would look like. I mean, the biggest spike we ever hit was 1000 views (Jan 2012) in one month. On average, we get around 200 views per month. Even if 25% of those people are actual players (and that is being generous), we are still looking at possibly 6 views on any given day with less chances that a game will even start. At least in terms of hardcore fans of the series, I can say there isn't enough left to jump start a new project. As a community, we need to start facing the fact that AW has officially flown off many people's radar. I think even if Custom Wars Tactics does become successful, it'll most likely fall into a niche of players that couldn't let go of the past. However, I do believe that if enough focus is put into new players that missed out on AW, it may be enough to bring it back.

However, the way CWT is now... it just won't work. The placeholder graphics will most likely remain, and a lot of the old ideas that plagued the older projects will still linger. Even if every single member of this community was invested in CWT, the fragmentation of all our ideas will create a mess of different project pieces in one whole. In the end, we'd probably end up scaring away new users with the wall of different mod rules, unit sets, and CO options available. The only way I see AW coming back is from a brand new game that is similar to AW, with new art assets, music, and updated graphics for today's devices. Just like AWDoR cleaned up a lot of the issues with AWDS (and added a bit of new ones), the new game has to refine everything we liked about AW and consolidate it into its own. This way, instead of a mess, we get a very focused product to criticize and improve.

With CWT, I hope that we all take time to really think about and discuss what we like about the games, and also what we can do without. Not only will we be slightly leaning AW back into the radar, but we will also have the foundation to jump start a new game. (Unless, IS actually surprises us with AW5... which deeply inside I really really want to happen. :arrr: )

JSRulz

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Narts
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Narts » Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:19 am

One idea I've been toying with, but probably won't ever do because of lack of time, is creating a mod for Civ V that would bring the mechanics closer to AW, simplify or remove the economic aspects and add "CO Powers".

Civ V has extensive support for scripting and mods, you can publish your creations through Steam Workshop and positive sides to this include that you can use the pre-existing art assets from Civ and that Civ is a popular game so you can siphon users off the existing fanbase.

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Xenesis
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Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Xenesis » Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:16 pm

That'd be an interesting project for sure. Although I have to say that the mod work would be quite extensive - the fundamental underpinnings of Civ V is quite different (I mean, there's the hex grid vs square grid issue at the very least). But it'd be awesome to see in action.
IST wrote:Even the worst individual needs to discover the joys of a chicken statue that is also a pregnant blonde housewife.

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Narts
Rank: hey daddy-o

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by Narts » Mon Dec 22, 2014 12:08 am

Yeah I meant making something that plays kind of like AW using the basic Civ 5 mechanics but isn't a straight up clone. The combat is pretty close already.

I imagine the mod would be more about removing things than adding them, but no need to get rid of hexes.

ztdent

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by ztdent » Wed Jan 07, 2015 5:13 pm

I might be able to help with music... In case you're interested...

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JSRulz

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by JSRulz » Thu Jan 08, 2015 7:10 am

Yeah, you've got my attention ztdent. Let me know what you can do...

JSRulz

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JSRulz

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by JSRulz » Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:33 pm

Hello,

For those who are interested in the project, I have a topic in the Custom Wars Tactics Forums. Some feedback will spawn more messages like this one...

Custom Wars Tactics Newsletter
http://w11.zetaboards.com/Custom_Wars_T ... 1351217/1/

You can respond here or there...

JSRulz

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The Thunder
Rank: 2D Game Artist
Location: South Portland

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by The Thunder » Thu Oct 01, 2015 10:15 pm

Oh? This project is still in the works? I am surprised. ...Except I heard that some of the custom COs are different from the ones everyone worked so hard on for the now deceased original Custom Wars project.

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JSRulz

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by JSRulz » Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:04 pm

The Thunder wrote:Oh? This project is still in the works? I am surprised. ...Except I heard that some of the custom COs are different from the ones everyone worked so hard on for the now deceased original Custom Wars project.
Yeah, it is still in the works. However, you did inquire about the Custom CO's, so I'll respond. Short answer is, you're right, they are different. It doesn't mean the ideas are fully lost...

Statistics for the Original Custom Wars Commanding Officers
http://forums.customwars.com/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=4546
Google Code Page for CWT Commanding Officers
https://code.google.com/p/cwtactics/wik ... ingOfficer

For a more complete answer on why, then I'll explain. The Original Custom Wars was high on balance, so they created a special mode in where they'd balance all the statistics of the Commanding Officers. Most created Commanding Officers adhered to that balance, making the statistics of most Commanding Officers very dry and uninteresting. Despite this, there were some interesting mechanics that came out of it, and I'd like to see that reflected in some way in Custom Wars Tactics.

Discussing Game Balance
http://cwtactics.blogspot.de/2015/02/of ... lance.html

The article above pretty much sums up my feelings about game balance in general. It is also a reason why I think that the newer Commanding Officers will be more like spiritual successors of their former selves. That isn't a bad thing, because if someone was determined enough, they'd just write in the normal versions themselves (It is only text files). However, I believe that if we want the game to evolve, we have to expand the mechanics and abilities, pushing the game to the limits of broken to see what we can get away with. I do feel a lot of the previous work will get redone in the future, because good ideas never die out.

JSRulz

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kiwi

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by kiwi » Sun Oct 04, 2015 3:44 pm

to be honest I just wanna make CRAP WARS on the new engine!

if it can handle that level of badness then you know it's good!

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DieselPheonix

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by DieselPheonix » Mon Oct 05, 2015 2:15 pm

...Make sure the game is stable and presentable first, not pandering to excessive use of explosions and capital letters.

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The Thunder
Rank: 2D Game Artist
Location: South Portland

Re: Custom Wars Tactics (Open Beta)

Post by The Thunder » Wed Oct 07, 2015 1:15 pm

Hey, as long as it isn't like Big Rigs, it's fine.

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